HomeMy WebLinkAboutAgenda - February 15, 2023 School Capital Needs Workgroup Agenda with notes ORANGE COUNTY BOARD OF COMMISSIONERS
CHAPEL HILL-CARRBORO BOARD OF EDUCATION
ORANGE COUNTY BOARD OF EDUCATION
Capital Needs Work Group
February 15, 2023
Meeting— 8:30-10am
The Capital Needs Work Group is conducting a Virtual Meeting on February 15, 2023. Members
of the Group will participate in the meeting remotely.
Attending: Jean Hamilton, Rhonda Rath, Patrick Abele, Perdita Holtz, Travis Myren, Bonnie
Hauser, Rani Dasi, Cy Stober, Al Ciarochi, Riza Jenkins, Alan Dorman, Greg Wilder, Andre
Stewart, Jonathan Scott, Patrick Florence, Kirk Vaughn
1. Welcome—Commissioner Jean Hamilton, Chair of Work Group
• Jean welcomes the group and provides introduction, thanks evaluation team.
2. Request for Qualifications Timeline Update
• Alan tells group that the evaluation team has picked Woolpert for the RFQ, starting
contract negotiation phase.
o Al—Both finalists were capable. Woolpert had more data view, and look at
the large scale needs. Major maintenance display.
o Patrick—Echo prior speakers. Both companies in North Carolina. Woolpert
presented better how to go into schools and provide detail on what needs to
fixed. Other finalist wanted districts to tell them what was wrong with
facilities. A lot of turnover in maintenance staff, OCS needs that external
assessment. Also has demographic and planning components in their
assessment. Better utilization and long term needs, rather than just
conditions.
• Jean opens to discussion.
• Bonnie asked: what is the timeline, how will they review politics and preferences?
One building has historical significance but is in disrepair. Wide preferences on
when a building is pulled. Community is attached to these buildings.
o Al - Consultant is not going to make a definitive direction, but will give
options. Consultant will give different options between renovation,
expansion or rebuilding, and their separate costs. Balanced
recommendations.
o Patrick - Scope is mainly focused on the condition of the buildings. Future
costs based on time of repair would come from county/districts. We would
have to make those decisions using the data the consultant provides.
• Jean reiterated question about the timeline.
o Alan—We are waiting for cost proposal estimate from Woolpert. Then we
will be in negotiation with Woolpert.
o Travis -March 7t'will be goal to present to board.
• Rani encourages to push work faster, as it looks like report will impact next year's
budget cycle, not this year's as hoped. Requests interim report to help with this
budget cycle.
• Rani recaps the work so far. Talks about the need, coordination between districts
and the funding models for the county to support the districts.
• Rani asks for information about consultant
o Alan provided detail on consultant, name and website in chat:
https://woolpert.com/
• Bonnie wants to include our practice on maintenance as part of scope,Rani concurs.
• Jean recaps the discussion, talks about importance of work and having all at the
table.
• Rani asked about cost of scope, as well as consultant's experience with school
districts.
o Alan—consultant has significant school district experience.
3. SAPFOTAC Action Items Update
• Perdita discusses SAPFOTAC update. Provides powerpoint summary(attached) of
11 counties from January kickoff meeting.
o School capacity is tracked by practice, not ordinance.
o School districts are the entity that tracks the information, sometimes with
the Planning department.
o Counties include school staff on development review committees.
o Triangle counties work with Operations Research and Education
Laboratory (OREd) at Institute of Transportation Research and Education
(ITRE) at NC State, usually through school district.
o SAPFOTAC to meet monthly,continue capital planning but remove legally
dubious portion of program, Certificate of Adequate Public Schools
(CAPS).
o Require changes to MOU and will require changes to four local government
land use regulations, Orange County, Town of Chapel Hill, Town of
Carrboro and Town of Hillsborough.
o Requires recommendation from planning boards, legal advertisements,
public hearings.
• Rani asked how counties get information from developers.
o Perdita—would get information from development review.
o Cy—question will be answered by OREd presentation at next SAPFOTAC
meeting.
• Patrick provides comments about the student generation rates and projections. Says
Orange County doesn't count students until they show up in school. Says he likes
the CAPS process, because developments need to work with schools. Staff cannot
attend all planning meanings.
• Rani asked about calculating different space requirements for EC and Pre-K. Asks
how we make sure all entities are caught up on SAPFO changes.
o Perdita- discussion at the SAPFOTAC about how that needs to be
incorporated.
• Bonnie brought up how Mebane is not included in SAPFOTAC. States
SAPFOTAC is not working due to one school is 20% over-capacity, and wants
relief.
• Cy talks about how all issues are included in the SAPFOTAC discussions,
discussion is focused on reviewing peers for their successful models.
o Jean states peer review not part of initial scope of workgroup's concerns.
• Jean notes that SAPFO will continue as public process can be very long and tough,
but county can make decisions not based on that, as the intent of the program was
to restrict development, which has not occurred. Intent is to make sure community
is informed and the schools need to have data regardless of SAPFO.
o Perdita - SAPFOTAC wants to present recommendations to replace
SAPFO, which is why they are doing peer review. Recommends removing
ordinance and MOUs.
o Cy- the intent is to show replacement program when removing SAPFO.
• Bonnie asks what OCS need to do in the meantime, as OCS will not be requesting
a new school in the near-term
o Cy - SAPFO exists and CAPS program exists until removed by ordinance
or MOU is removed. Report will still be provided annually, which will
include language on EC and Charter School impacts.
• Rani asked how we ensure that developers come to table with information after
SAPFO without burdening staff. SAPFO also has a long history, which has
credibility, even if it has incorrect assumptions.
• Patrick asked if peer reviews had complexity of Orange County, multiple
municipalities and districts. Make sure district projections match county.
o Travis -Buncombe is part of peer analysis. Asks if county can create a new
projection model, and cleanup land ordinance.
■ Perdita- ordinance language includes specific model, so that would
need to be updated.
o Travis-Intent is not to push work onto school staff,to work collaboratively.
• Jean thanks Perdita, Cy and the SAPFO team. States we still want to make a model
that help make decisions, irrespective of current system.
• Perdita states committee is meeting once a month, including this Friday. Timeline
requires consensus with all peers.
4. Discussion and Group Next Steps
• Jean asked what if we want to continue meeting as a workgroup.
o Patrick has appreciated the workgroup as a measure to get together.
Recommends every other month. Wants to have consultant to talk to group
about next steps.
• Bonnie requests monthly progress report from consultant.Requests continuation of
conversation on funding needs.
o Rani concurs with Bonnie and Patrick. Appreciates workgroup forum for
interim needs.
• Bonnie asks if we can do an interim capital plan until consultant work is done,
currently needs to provide 10 year plan to county.
o Jean recommends continuing 10 year plan, as consultant has not yet been
approved by board.
o Kirk says county needs a 10 year plan, as it is important for the county to
understand its debt capacity. Helps county understand size for next bond
issuance. Also, the board only approves year 1 of the CIP, and the rest
functions as a plan, which can change for year to year.
o Al says there is still a plan to use funding for major maintenance projects.
Sees the consultant's role is to help for bond issuance and the next steps.
o Patrick states there needs to be understanding that long range plans are
based on estimates from 10 year old plans. So long as that estimate is
understood.
o Travis confirms that we need dollar amounts for out years; that exact
projects can change.
• Jean asks that we get the document that shows the unfunded needs, not just the
funding amounts.
o Kirk — when we provide forms to schools we do ask for unfunded needs,
which is tracked year to year.
o Jean—asks if that is given by year.
o Kirk—is given as a 10 year total, not by year.
o Rani—we can provide a signal based on current assessment, but consultant
will provide that information in more detail.
5. Next Meeting is TBD
• Jean—suggests every 2 months from this month-April, June, and August.
• Jean suggests April Meeting to discuss CIPs.
o Kirk—April meeting will occur after Manager presents Recommended CIP.
o Patrick—useful to have CIP discussion to coordinate projects to bid.
• Jean suggests using April Meeting to meet with consultant,to assess scope of work.
• Rani request SAFPOTEC update at April Meeting. Wants this group to have input
on that process.
o Jean asks when if there will be a formal plan at April meeting,may be better
for June meeting.
o Perdita—SAPFOTEC will receive presentation from OREd,will determine
pace of next steps.
o Bonnie asks if there is guidance on an upcoming needed redistricting based
on Mebane growth.
■ Cy — staff have draft of SAPFO annual report which includes
projections from 5 models.
■ Patrick — SAPFO, OREd and other models play a role in
reassignment.
• Jean concludes meeting with school CIPs, consultant and SAFPO update as
possible agenda items for April Meeting.
• Minutes to be provided to group,with Perdita's powerpoint.
Adjourn
Capital Needs Work Group virtual meetings are open to the public to attend remotely. Should
any member of the public wish to view this meeting, please click the following link to register:
Capital Needs Workgroup Registration Link
After registering, you will receive a follow-up email which will allow you to access and view the
meeting. If you have any comments or questions, would like to submit any written comments to
the group, or would like an emailed copy of the entire agenda package for this meeting, please
email Kirk Vaughn at kvaughnnoran eg coun . nc.gov before 3:00 pm on February 13, 2023