HomeMy WebLinkAboutAgenda - April 19, 2023 School Capital Needs Workgroup Agenda with Minutes ORANGE COUNTY BOARD OF COMMISSIONERS
CHAPEL HILL-CARRBORO BOARD OF EDUCATION
ORANGE COUNTY BOARD OF EDUCATION
Capital Needs Work Group
April 19, 2023
Meeting— 8:30-10am
The Capital Needs Work Group is conducting a Virtual Meeting on April 19, 2023. Members of
the Group will participate in the meeting remotely.
Group: Steve Arndt, Kirk Vaughn, Perdita Holtz, Jean Hamilton, David Sturtz, Greg Wilder,
Bonnie Hauser, Dwayne Foster, Travis Myren, Al Ciarochi, Thomas Dudley, Cy Stober, Riza
Jenkins, Rani Dasi, Patrick Florence, Jessica Goodell, Patrick Abele, Gary Donaldson, Andre
Stewart, Patrick Florence
1. Welcome—Commissioner Jean Hamilton, Chair of Work Group
Jean reviews agenda, leads introductions and welcomes group.
2. Woolpert Inc. Introduction and Presentation
• Jessica Goodell and David Sturtz presents (slides to be provided with minutes)
o Team works together for 10 years doing this work.
o Project timeline. Work to be done by year end.
o Deliverables: Condition Assessment Data, Educational Adequacy Results,
Projects, Optimization plan.
o Facility Condition Assessment + Utilization to determine needs of the
schools. Establish target range.
o Uses special information, to determine where size and location are not
match population needs.
o Shows Guilford report example.
• Bonnie—asked about the space needs and maintenances.
o Jessica—assessment will go to component level to determine what needs to
be replaced. Can provide maintenance estimates (3-5% as standard
estimate).
o David — On location, looking at capacity versus population, what is the
utilization of that building?Where is the population moving?Uses example
in nearby county where the data shows that families are not sticking to three
older elementary schools. Data recommends replacing those with modern
elementary schools, not maintaining current schools.
• Jean — asks what reasons can the data provide to let us know why students are
leaving?
o David — "art and science". Consultant can see some overall trends, but
district leaders may be able to provide the "why" students leave.
• Rani— sees maintenance needs as an important deliverable. Asks which standards
will be used?
o David — uses state, local and internal standards to determine best use,
negotiate between groups.
• Jean—who are being talked to during consulting?
o David — Patrick Abele and Al Ciarochi are the points of contact for these
conversations.
• Jean/Rasi—What sustainability and safety features are considered?
o Jessica — can use some standards to plan for replacement costs to match
sustainability needs going forward.
o David—we can set safety standards, like front office must have direct site
line to main entry. We then grade how buildings match and don't match
that. Assess the gap.
• Bonnie—how do the space considerations come from?As well OCS needs the info
as school district going through redistricting.
o David—need to have input data from school districts to create deliverables,
all data that consultant creates will be accessible to school districts.
• Rani—when will school board be provided this information?
o Jessica — we will coordinate with school staff for presentations to school
boards.
3. SAPFOTAC Action Items Update — NC State OREd Student Projection
Model
Cy gives introduction
• Thomas Dudley Presents (Slides Provided with Minutes)
o OREd uses historic enrollment data and current/future land use growth to
project future enrollment. Provide school and district capacity information.
o Provides information about NC State's Institute for Transportation
Research and Education (ITRE) provides information related to
Transportation in NC for over 40 years. Within ITRE is Operational
Research and Educational Laboratory (OREd), which provides unbiased
expertise to help depoliticize the school planning process.
o Provides enrollment forecasts,land use studies,out of capacity analysis,and
optimization. Has worked with many districts in NC, including OCS and
CHCCS in the past.
o Enrollment forecast utilizes land use changes and development to help
project future enrollment. Coordinate with all planning agencies.
o Provides enrollment out-of-capacity table of Chatham County as example,
showing capacity by school over ten year period.
o Shows Johnson County GIS example, shows how planned development
would be modeled. Uses comparable current developments to project a
student generation rate for future development.
• Rani—How you get data from developers?
o Thomas - OREd works directly with planning agencies,who would receive
this information from developers.
• Cy — Pointed out how OREd utilizes Pre-K enrollment in Chatham County
example.
o Thomas — Shows how Pre-K reduces capacity in buildings from initial
building size.
• Bonnie — How do we make sure we don't have both consultants doing the same
work?Also asked how charter enrollment is being factored into projections?
o David — Enrollment projections are not on Woolpert scope, so Woolpert
will get the same information as OREd and use it for different purposes.
Also Woolpert will utilize projection information from OREd.
• Rani—How will EC and adapted classrooms be included?
o David—Those classroom uses will be part of the deliverable from Woolpert,
which will determine building capacity by its actual usage.
• Rani—How will we add that overlay to a model?
o Perdita — Current model of SAPFO has very specific parameters around
building capacity. County is in the process of possibly rescinding SAPFO
so districts can better determine building capacity on a school by school
basis.
o Cy — County will utilize recommendations from Woolpert and districts to
provide better capacity analysis.
• Bonnie — State is looking to change the rules for fourth and fifth grade capacity,
how does that get figured in.
o Jean — County is at a fortunate place to have this additional information
from consultants, but need to have a robust process to take all that
information in and figure out the model going forward,knowing it will have
to be updated.
o Cy — Adds that this is a frustration with SAPFO, since we are reactive.
OREd allows us to be more flexible to proactively adapt to changing
standards.
• Jean—Confirms that workgroup is comfortable using OREd going forward for this
info.
• Kirk — County wants both districts to contract with OREd quickly so OREd can
provide deliverable on Woolpert's timeline. County will reimburse those expenses.
o Patrick—OCS is contracting with OREd to plan a redistricting, will that be
part of the reimbursement?
o Kirk—County will just reimburse the costs for the capital planning part of
the scope.
• Rani—What is the process for this change?
o Travis—OREd and Woolpert will work through their contracts. The BoCC
has the authority to change the projection for SAPFO in the MOU.
4. Orange County FY 2023-2033 Capital Investment Plan Presentation
• Kirk Vaughn Presents (Slides Provided with Minutes)
o Three topics for discussion on CIP as it relates to school
o First overview of the purpose of a CIP. 10 year plan, but board approves
only year 1. The board approves a capital ordinance, so all funds are
authorized forever without board action. So on July 1, schools have all
unspent funds in prior years plus whatever was in the approved year 1.
o However, it is a 10 year model. Utilizes years 2-10 as a planning model to
determine capacity and ensure no surprises.
o Second overview is the funding sources. County has limited legal funding
vehicles for capital investments. Majority of county CIP is debt financing
supported by taxes, referendum bonds supported by taxes, and pay-as-you-
go or cash funding supported by taxes. There are also proprietary funds that
support their own debt, and sometimes county projects are jointly funded
by capital partners.
o Debt has legal and policy restrictions. County is obligated to pay all debt
service payments, county has a policy that restricts debt service payments
to 15% of General Fund Revenues. Bond rating agencies also review that
ratio, so exceeding that ratio significantly can lower county's bond rating,
and thus increase interest rates.
o Pay-go only is restricted by the county's ability to cash fund projects.Future
pay-go is modeled in the county's long term operating model.
o County models its current and future debt service.Planned referendum bond
will increase debt service slightly over policy and require two tax rate
increases over 10 year horizon.
o Current plan for bond is$130 M voted on November 2024. County will then
provide $5 M in planning funds in FY 26, then $40 M, $45 M and $40 M
in three tranches in FY 27, 29 and 31.
o Possible bond schedule included in powerpoint.
o County asks voters to broadly approve funding for school district, not
specific expenses.
o Lastly, there is interest in joint planning between schools and county.
Details process on how county can plan to do RFQs,and ask districts to add
like projects. County also details its specific year one plans in CIP.
• Rani—Will there be a bond committee?
o Travis—County will coordinate through school collaboration.
• Bonnie—When will the bond be?
o Kirk—Votes in 24, funding in 26 through 31.
• Bonnie—Joint Bidding. How does that work?
o Steve — County will communicate with districts when there are
opportunities.
o Al — Will be opportunities, but there are significant challenges around
design. Thinks there will be only limited times where this can be done, but
is excited about the cost savings when those opportunities align.
o Steve— Schools also need to focus on summer projects as well.
o Al—Yes,noise and odors on roof work makes that required to be done over
summer.
• Patrick—asks about the increasing costs of recurring capital expenses.
o Kirk—We do see a need to add an inflationary increase to recurring capital,
it is $3 M currently.
o Kirk—County also provided cash-funded additional capital funding, which
can be utilized to supplement recurring capital allotments now.
• Jean — Part of the work of this taskforce is to determine the correct amounts of
funding to meet the needs of the schools. Also simplify the sources so public can
understand and the schools are receiving what they need.
5. Discussion and Group Next Steps
• Patrick — we will have data to provide to consultant and will inform board of
upcoming bond referendum. Appreciate the planning funds in the bond to keep
projects on track.
• Bonnie—Some of the use of the bonds will be informed by the Woolpert consultant.
We will need to prioritize, as needs are significantly higher than $130 M.
6. Next Meeting is TBD
• Jean-Next meeting will be in June, but is there any need to come back in May.
• Bonnie—Would we have any data from Woolpert and OREd by June?
o David—We plan to be in the field at June. We will have model but no data by
June. Best check in would be in August for data.
• Bonnie/Rani—When would there be a deliverable for SAPFO/OREd?
o Kirk—Understands that the land use assessment will take time, and OREd would
have a deliverable by September.
o Cy—In terms of policy changes, there is a draft plan to replace SAPFO. The
towns would not be able to rescind the CAPS program in SAPFO until the Fall.
There can be deliverables for the Workgroup to review prior to that point.
o Jean—policy language is for the county and school boards, not for this
workgroup.
• Jean—June is the next meeting, but unclear what topics will be ready to review at that
meeting. If not, next meeting will be August or September.
• Bonnie—Can we go through the different pots of capital funding for the schools?
o Jean—Possible deeper dive about what are the pots of capital funding.
Adjourn
Capital Needs Work Group virtual meetings are open to the public to attend remotely. Should
any member of the public wish to view this meeting, please click the following link to register:
Capital Needs Workgroup Registration Link
After registering, you will receive a follow-up email which will allow you to access and view the
meeting. If you have any comments or questions, would like to submit any written comments to
the group, or would like an emailed copy of the entire agenda package for this meeting, please
email Kirk Vaughn at kvaughn&oran ec�ountync.gov before 3:00 pm on April 18, 2023