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HomeMy WebLinkAboutPlanning Board minutes - 050521 Approved 6/2/21 1 MEETING MINUTES 2 ORANGE COUNTY PLANNING BOARD 3 MAY 5,2021 4 REGULAR MEETING 5 (Due to current public health concerns, this meeting was held virtually. 6 Members of the Planning Board, staff and public participated remotely) 7 8 MEMBERS PRESENT: David Blankfard (Chair), Hillsborough Township Representative; Adam Beeman (Vice-Chair), Cedar 9 Grove Township Representative; Susan Hunter, Chapel Hill Township Representative; Lamar Proctor, Cheeks Township 10 Representative; Randy Marshall, At-Large Representative; Alexandra Allman, At-Large Representative; Melissa Poole, 11 Little River Township Representative; Carrie Fletcher, Bingham Township Representative; Whitney Watson, At-Large 12 Representative; Charity Kirk,At-Large Representative 13 14 MEMBERS ABSENT: Kim Piracci, Eno Township Representative;Vacant,At-Large Representative, 15 16 STAFF PRESENT: Craig Benedict, Planning Director; Perdita Holtz, Planning Systems Coordinator; Molly Boyle, Planner ll, 17 Tyler Sliger, Planner I, Michael Harvey, Current Planning Supervisor; Tina Love,Administrative Support 18 19 OTHERS PRESENT: Warren Mitchell,Applicant;Alaine Pribisko;Albert Lauritano;Andrea Sordean-Mintzer;Angelique 20 Lawyer; Janice Cenci; Helen Booher; Jessamyn Harris;John Tullo; Katherine Pinard; Lucy Harber; Jenny Chafe; 21 22 Perdita reviewed the technical processes and rules for the virtual meeting 23 24 25 AGENDA ITEM 1: CALL TO ORDER AND ROLL CALL 26 Chair David Blankfard called the meeting to order. 27 28 29 AGENDA ITEM 2: INFORMATION ITEMS 30 a. Planning Calendar for May and June 31 32 33 AGENDA ITEM 3: APPROVAL OF MINUTES 34 April 7, 2021 Regular Meeting Minutes 35 36 MOTION BY Randy Marshall to approve the April 7, 2021 Regular Meeting Minutes. Seconded by Sue Hunter. 37 38 ROLLCALL VOTE: 39 Randy Marshall Yes 40 Adam Beeman Yes 41 Susan Hunter Yes 42 Charity Kirk Yes 43 Lamar Proctor Yes 44 Melissa Poole Yes 45 Whitney Watson Yes 46 Carrie Fletcher Yes 47 David Blankfard Yes 48 MOTION PASSED UNANIMOUSLY 49 50 Alexandra Allman arrived 51 52 53 AGENDA ITEM 4: CONSIDERATION OF ADDITIONS TO AGENDA. 54 55 There were none 56 Approved 6/2/21 57 58 AGENDA ITEM 5: PUBLIC CHARGE 59 60 INTRODUCTION TO THE PUBLIC CHARGE 61 The Board of County Commissioners, under the authority of North Carolina General Statute, appoints 62 the Orange County Planning Board (OCPB) to uphold the written land development law of the County. 63 The general purpose of OCPB is to guide and accomplish coordinated and harmonious development. 64 OCPB shall do so in a manner, which considers the present and future needs of its citizens and 65 businesses through efficient and responsive process that contributes to and promotes the health, safety, 66 and welfare of the overall County. The OCPB will make every effort to uphold a vision of responsive 67 governance and quality public services during our deliberations, decisions, and recommendations. 68 69 PUBLIC CHARGE 70 The Planning Board pledges to the citizens of Orange County its respect. The Board asks its citizens to 71 conduct themselves in a respectful, courteous manner, both with the Board and with fellow citizens. At 72 any time, should any member of the Board or any citizen fail to observe this public charge, the Chair will 73 ask the offending member to leave the meeting until that individual regains personal control. Should 74 decorum fail to be restored, the Chair will recess the meeting until such time that a genuine commitment 75 to this public charge is observed. 76 77 78 AGENDA ITEM 6: CHAIR COMMENTS 79 80 There were none 81 82 83 AGENDA ITEM 7: MAJOR SUBDIVISION CONCEPT PLAN REVIEW —To review and take action on a Concept Plan application 84 for a Major Subdivision called Pyewacket. The proposal within Orange County is for a 2-lot subdivision 85 on 70.79 acres (PIN 9757-51-3504) located in Bingham Township, south of the junction of Jones Ferry 86 Road and Ferguson Road, straddling the Orange County—Chatham County line. An Orange County 87 major subdivision review process is necessary for this subdivision because a new public road and open 88 space are proposed to be dedicated. The portion of the subdivision within Chatham County contains 89 128.39 acres and all 93 habitable lots will be in Chatham County. 90 Presenter: Molly Boyle, Planning II 91 92 Molly Boyle Presented the Pyewacket Subdivision Project Application Concept Plan 93 94 Warren Mitchell,Applicant for the Pyewacket Subdivision presented additional information to the Planning Board 95 96 David Blankfard: When Pyewacket comes out to Jones Ferry,where's the house that is across the way. 97 98 Warren Mitchell: I think it's directly across the street from the entrance. Several of these lots have homes on Jones Ferry. 99 100 David Blankfard: My concern is at night the cars are going to be putting their bright lights right into their front room. Was 101 that considered? 102 103 Warren Mitchell: No, I was really considering the wetlands, streams and the power poles on the property in finding the 104 best way out to Jones Ferry. 105 106 Whitney Watson: Is there a minimum output for the wells that would impact the development of Pyewacket? 107 108 Warren Mitchell: The only minimum I'm aware of is there has to be a minimum of two wells if you have over 49 houses on 109 a community system. I know Aqua would like to see 20 gallons per minute per well if you have 20 minimum per well that 110 would be 40 on two wells. That would probably be enough for 93 houses. 111 112 Whitney Watson: Is this going to be gated in some way off Jones Ferry? Approved 6/2/21 113 114 Warren Mitchell: Definitely not. 115 116 Whitney Watson: Is the road and the length of the road sufficient to handle traffic from 93 households. 117 118 Warren Mitchell: There's not a lot of homes but DOT would probably require two entrances if they considered it too large 119 and it's not at that level. 120 121 Whitney Watson: I know Molly said there are no plans for remaining acreages but I'm trying to imagine what might be 122 placed there and if that is going to impact roadways and traffic in a few years. 123 124 Warren Mitchell: It's the same owner as this property and I'm not aware of any plans he has to sell it. The remaining 125 property is on a long stretch of Jones Ferry so there are plenty of places to access Jones Ferry. It's not limited like this 126 piece is for where it can come out. 127 128 Whitney Watson: The application says the HOA will be responsible for managing the public spaces in the 11-acre parcel. 129 Is the HOA guided by some principles on how it's managed? I would hope the principle of lowest costs is not the one that 130 guides everything else. 131 132 Warren Mitchell: There will be some maintenance of the landscaping at the entrance and the rest of the open space will 133 be left natural. The plan is to put a trail network in the open space and have the trail come up into Orange County not all 134 the way to the entrance but at least to the southern part. The gas line is cleared so that's a good place to have the trail go 135 throughout the neighborhood and connect to the open space. 136 137 Carrie Fletcher: I live on a natural gas line and maintenance on it is probably every few, maybe 5 years. It's just going to 138 be an overgrown strip of land? 139 140 Warren Mitchell: No,we're intending to mow it and keep it maintained. 141 142 Carrie Fletcher: When you are no longer the developer? It goes back to the HOA? 143 144 Warren Mitchell: Yes,we'll set that up and have it done and once the houses are done they will keep it mowed. There will 145 be a trail in the easement as well. A natural trail. 146 147 Lamar Proctor: What's being proposed to protect the perennial stream and does this subdivision in Chatham connect with 148 Morgan Ridge? 149 150 Warren Mitchell: Yes, the preservation/open space does connect with Morgan Ridge open space. As far as protection of 151 the perennial stream, all the land in the jurisdictional stream or the stream buffer is the shaded area and the open space is 152 larger than the stream buffer. All the natural space around the stream will provide protection. 153 154 Lamar Proctor: Is traffic going to evidently connect with Morgan Ridge, I know we're not talking about Morgan Ridge but 155 it's right next door and the neighbors at the community meeting voiced concerns about Morgan Ridge being built right next 156 to this one and creating a traffic issue on Jones Ferry Road from all these houses. Looking at a broader map, it seems like 157 if I were a developer, I'd want access to Jones Ferry Road so I could shoot straight up to Carrboro. If I have to go the 158 other way, I've got to go the long way around to get to anything. 159 160 Warren Mitchell: Morgan Ridge already comes out at Jones Ferry. The part in back has been approved and it connects to 161 Phase 1 which is already built and comes out in Chatham just past this enclave on Jones Ferry Road. 162 163 Lamar Proctor: Will there be roads connecting Morgan Ridge and Pyewacket? 164 165 Warren Mitchell: No,there's no road and Morgan Ridge has been approved in Chatham already so there's no access 166 stubouts that connect the two. 167 168 Lamar Proctor: Is there a plan to connect them? Approved 6/2/21 169 170 Warren Mitchell: No. Morgan Ridge has been approved. It's gone through the Commissioners and there is no connection 171 between them. 172 173 Lamar Proctor: Ok, I assume that two subdivisions being build next to each other with no connection and then a year or 174 two later, they're connected and now there's a traffic issue so I am trying to look out for the people on Jones Ferry who 175 voiced that concern. Do you think that it will eventually be connected or this is a permanent situation, one is one and the 176 other is the other? 177 178 Warren Mitchell: Yes, it is and as well, Morgan Ridge already has a direct public road access to Jones Ferry. There are 179 no plans to connect but if it was connected it wouldn't provide a better access to Jones Ferry. It wouldn't be easier or 180 faster, it already has a direct connection. The only access to Morgan Ridge is from Jones Ferry Road. 181 182 Lamar Proctor: Do you need the well in Orange County? Could there be a third well in Chatham County? 183 184 Warren Mitchell: There could,yes. I am trying to plan for something that is hard to predict with the well yields. Honestly, 185 at the neighborhood meeting, I heard there was a concern to the neighbors so I have been thinking about it. It's 186 understandably concerning if you have a low yield well, if your well is not tapped into a good aquifer,that's concerning that 187 you don't have enough. Especially if a community well comes in across the street and is pulling 10 or 20 times what you're 188 pulling off yours. It doesn't have to go in Orange County. I was trying to provide a third well location and maybe I'll have 189 to find another one in Chatham County. 190 191 Lamar Proctor: I don't know where water and sewer lines are in Chatham; is there any water and sewer close that 192 eventually, in the future, will hook up to this area or is that not even in the foreseeable future? 193 194 Warren Mitchell: Chatham,just like Orange, does not have any county sewer but their water lines are good. They are just 195 too far away. They are about 10 miles away, they took some larger roads where higher density was projected and it was 196 probably too expensive at the time to come out this way. It's not likely to ever make it this far out. 197 198 Lamar Proctor: This looks like a really nice subdivision and I like the way it is constructed as a conservation thing but the 199 question that the residents asked is what's in it for Orange County? To add to traffic,to have a well so that's my question 200 to you Mr. Mitchell, is it just progress and just being nice? I am trying to understand what's in it for Orange County. 201 202 Warren Mitchell: Well there's 9 acres of open space but there are no homes being provided, I don't know if that's a good 203 or bad thing. 204 205 Lamar Proctor: I appreciate your candor, I think people there will hit Jones Ferry and probably come to Carrboro to spend 206 money so there's that. 207 208 Charity Kirk: One of the community members was asking why this wasn't connected to Morgan Ridge, one of the roads in 209 Morgan Ridge,why wasn't that planned for? Why are you trying to have a separate road since you are also the same 210 developer. 211 212 Warren Mitchell: It's different ownership. I was a partner for Morgan Ridge. When Morgan Ridge was approved, there 213 was a lot of focus on the upland depression swamp/forest in the middle of the property. We changed the layout to 214 preserve a unique feature in the middle of the property. There were no plans for this subdivision at that time. It was 215 natural to connect to Phase 1. This road still would have been needed at the time we did this project to get access to 216 Jones Ferry. 217 218 Charity Kirk: Where would the nearest school be? 219 220 Warren Mitchell: The nearest elementary is Perry Harrison, about 10 miles. The middle school is Margaret Pollard and 221 the high school is Northwood which is running into Pittsboro. Chatham schools are excellent. It will probably a mix of 222 family and empty nesters and first time buyers,a little bit of everybody that want to live here. 223 224 Charity Kirk: What is this going to cost Orange County, as far as road maintenance or anything of that nature? Approved 6/2/21 225 226 Molly Boyle: The road is to be built to a public standard and the County doesn't maintain roads. It will be the North 227 Carolina Department of Transportation (NCDOT)there wouldn't be any cost of maintenance or upkeep to Orange County. 228 229 Charity Kirk: So a suggestion that you review the house across the street for how this road may affect them and plan 230 accordingly. As far as water goes,what is the aquifer status in this area? Do we know?Or do we just have rumors that 231 wells are running dry? 232 233 Warren Mitchell: I live in a house on a couple of acres with a well and I put the well in a convenient location so a lot of time 234 with a single family,where you can put a well is limited versus a larger piece of property. It depends, if you tap an aquifer. 235 On the concept plan,there is a well in Chatham County and I'm trying to get them closer to where the streams are without 236 being in the stream itself but nearby there is a stream. I've also considered moving them down, I'm trying to get close to 237 where an aquifer might be. My well yield at home is not great, it's enough for the house but I think that is what happens, 238 you drill your well and you get enough for a house and then in dry periods the yield might be less,the groundwater level 239 can drop in summer. 240 241 Charity Kirk: So what water conservation measures are you including in the project since that is a concern in the area? 242 243 Warren Mitchell: I think the appliances today use a lot less. 244 245 Charity Kirk: So you don't have don't have any special plans for water conservation, you're just going with current 246 standards? 247 248 Warren Mitchell: Why don't I present this to you when I come back with the first plat,the preliminary plat. 249 250 Charity Kirk: I would be interested in water conservation measures and at one of the community meetings someone 251 suggested disallowing swimming pools, private swimming pools. Have you thought about that any more? 252 253 Warren Mitchell: I have and I think it's a great idea and I'm going to enforce that and make it part of the HOA. 254 255 Carrie Fletcher: Why the decision to have community wells as opposed to homeowners getting their own wells? Is it 256 acreage? 257 258 Warren Mitchell: I think that it's more efficient and I think a lot of people that do not live on wells and are not familiar with 259 them are more comfortable having a public utility or entity manage the water. I think it's more efficient than drilling 93 wells 260 on the property and I don't know why individual wells would be considered better. 261 262 Carrie Fletcher: What happens if these wells don't come through? 263 264 Warren Mitchell: We will keep looking;we could drill several locations and we're going to have a storage tank; not one up 265 in the air, it will be on the ground. We might have to add an extra storage tank. 266 267 Alexandra Allman: Can you speak to the income for the housing that you trying to attract? 268 269 Warren Mitchell: We don't have that information at this time. 270 271 Alexandra Allman: Is that something that you can provide at the next meeting? 272 273 Warren Mitchell: I don't believe that we are required to do that, not something the County can ask. We're really just not at 274 that point. 275 276 Molly Boyle: To clarify, generally speaking,the County, and my supervisor and I talked about this today because that 277 question has come up, but the County is not making subdivision determinations based on the proposed value of the 278 homes going in. That's not something that we ask for as part of the application process in terms of the subdivision. 279 280 Alexandra Allman: You were saying that these homes are around $500,000 that I read somewhere? Approved 6/2/21 281 282 Warren Mitchell: I don't know exactly, it might start at that. 283 284 David Blankfard: How many square feet is being planned for the whole subdivision, and can the septic system handle it? 285 286 Warren Mitchell: The septic systems are all to be designed by how many bedrooms are in the house. At this time,we're 287 guessing 3 and 4 bedroom homes. 288 289 Lamar Proctor: Do these wells feed just Pyewacket or will they also feed Morgan Ridge? Does Morgan Ridge have its 290 own wells? 291 292 Warren Mitchell: Just Pyewacket, Morgan Ridge has a possible well site but we have not put in wells for Morgan Ridge 293 yet. The well in Orange County will only serve Pyewacket. 294 295 Adam Beeman: Regarding the well in Orange County, I can't tell where the utility poles are located but if you did move 296 that well off the Orange County property, you said the lot across the street is well back off the road so you could move the 297 driveway down in front of that property instead. Traffic and headlights wouldn't affect them as much since they are well 298 back from the road. 299 300 Warren Mitchell: I think that's a good idea. If I get really close to this wetland, that just starts here (indicated on map), 1 301 think I can make it work. I think we're doing a good thing even if I slightly impact this wetland on the very edge. I think 302 that's a worthwhile pursuit. 303 304 Adam Beeman: What is the plan if, say, the subdivision is sold out and everybody is moved in and our wells are running 305 dry? What is your backup to supply water to the homeowners? 306 307 Warren Mitchell: Every house in the County has wells, I just think it's expecting we all manage. You can go deeper. 308 309 Adam Beeman: I know there was a development in Raleigh that was having issues where they were running out of water. 310 1 have a well so I understand about conserving and not wasting water. I'm just curious if there is a plan long-term for if 311 there was an issue. 312 313 Warren Mitchell: I think maybe we could have a few locations in reserve on the property where another well could be 314 drilled. I don't know that wells run dry too often; luckily this area is kind of spread out. If you tap a good aquifer,you're in 315 good shape. I think you run dry when you're in an aquifer that doesn't produce enough. I guess you would know early on 316 if that were the case. It's definitely something that I want to get answered early. 317 318 Whitney Watson: I believe you said the water supply was going to be managed by a private utility company;will they or a 319 similar entity manage the septic systems? 320 321 Warren Mitchell: The septics are all individual. There will be a couple that are combined in an area but they will still not 322 fall under a public utility. The HOA might have a consultant that looks after those systems. Most of them will be on each 323 lot,just a standard system. 324 325 Whitney Watson: Are sufficient repair fields being allowed for the development? Maybe that really falls to Chatham 326 County since the sewer fields are going to be in Chatham but it's an operational concern down the road. 327 328 Warren Mitchell: Chatham has the same rules that Orange has to follow as far as septic. 329 330 Molly Boyle: You're correct,there is no septic proposed in Orange County so the review authority would be Chatham 331 County on that. 332 333 Lucy Harber: I want to thank the Planning Board members for your careful review of the comments that we sent in and 1 334 did send in written comments but also felt compelled to speak as well because I feel pretty passionate about water and 335 traffic. I didn't think I could communicate that as easily in letter or email but I also wanted to thank you. Historically, 336 Orange County is pretty careful in its approach to planning and development because it has protected the environment Approved 6/2/21 337 and natural resources that we enjoy out here. I really appreciate being able to do country living out here for the last 35 338 years. We've seen a lot of change during that time but this is a lot of change that is happening very fast. In addition to the 339 Pyewacket,there is also Morgan's Ridge which is adding another close to 50 houses so we basically have a small city 340 mushrooming out here near our quiet rural area. It's kind of a concern in the fact that they have to supply water to all of 341 these homes both in Pyewacket and Morgan's Ridge which is a big draw on the existing ground water. I am not a 342 hydrologist and I don't propose that I understood the reports that I was reading, but for what I read, it seems like there is 343 not actually an aquifer in this part of Orange County. In terms of well yields,this is one of the parts of the County where 344 the well yields are the lowest and that is because of the rock formations underground, you're not actually tapping into an 345 aquifer,you are getting cracks in the rock. The further down you go,you don't necessarily hit more water because the 346 weight of the ground compresses the crack so there are fewer cracks. The small yield wells that we have which most of 347 my neighbors also deal with on a daily basis, drilling deeper doesn't necessarily help you. The most recent neighbor who 348 drilled a well had to go 700 feet and it was a very expensive endeavor. I don't know how much more water they are 349 getting out of it but I think it's the geology of this part of the County. One of the things that I requested in my brief 350 comments,was hopefully someone from the North Carolina ground water state agencies could come in and answer 351 questions for us or provide us with data from some of the monitoring wells there in Orange County. The maps that 1 352 looked at did not seem to have any wells that were very close to here but in the statistics it did have there is a lot of 353 variability in wells in Orange County. In the summer and winter you really start to panic about if there is going to be 354 enough water. 355 356 Helen Booher: I live on Jones Ferry Road not too far down from the intersection with Ferguson and I'll second everything 357 that Lucy said with the wells. We've had our wells run dry lots of times during the summer and we've been told that this 358 area of Orange County and over into Chatham is just kind of how it is. I'm concerned that with the number of houses that's 359 proposed for this development that houses really would need to conserve water and how do you get that number of 360 households to work together and do that? I think that we'll be drilling all over the place trying to find enough water for that 361 number of households. Also,traffic is a big concern with everyone commuting in the morning over the University Lake, 1 362 think traffic is going to get very backed up. Also, as mentioned before,the section of Jones Ferry Road this is at is a very 363 straight section so it's the first straight stretch of road and people really speed up right at this part of the road. That's going 364 to be a dangerous situation for having more cars entering on and off the road here. People use Jones Ferry to bike a lot 365 there on a curvy road with more traffic, I think that is going to be a dangerous situation as well. 366 367 Warren Mitchell I think that most of the issues have to do with water and traffic and I am going to work on both of those 368 and talk to NCDOT regarding Jones Ferry and what can be done. It is an existing problem and people are speeding up 369 there. I don't have any thoughts about it at this time. 370 371 David Blankfard: Do they have to have a traffic study? 372 373 Molly Boyle: That's going to be up to NCDOT to determine.Attachment 6 is the ITE Trip Generation data. They haven't 374 fully submitted to NCDOT yet. Mr. Mitchell was waiting to see if the Concept Plan was feasible before moving forward with 375 the cost associated with applying with NCDOT. It is possible based on the Trip Generation data that they will required to 376 have a Traffic Impact Analysis(TIA) but I'm not sure yet. I did talk to Jennifer Britt who is the Assistant District Engineer 377 for Highway Division 8, District 1 which is the one that oversees Chatham County and she is aware of the project. She 378 saw the ITE Trip Generation Report and she's seen the Concept Plan but they are still reviewing. They haven't gotten the 379 formal submittal yet in order to determine if a TIA is required but it is possible. If that is required,then NCDOT review and 380 approval would be required as part of the Preliminary Plat, not the acceptance of it but their review would be part of the 381 Preliminary Plat that would come before you next time. 382 383 Charity Kirk: What realistically, can we do? I appreciated Lucy's acquifer/not really aquifer status so I would find it helpful 384 to me to know more about the water status for the area. Can this be postponed until Morgan Ridge is further along? Right 385 now there are 50 houses going in and now we are going to be bumping it up to 150 houses in a pretty non dense area so 386 what realistically can we do at as a Board right now? Is that to approve it we would like this in the future or what can we 387 do? 388 389 Michael Harvey: So I think that the straightforward answer is you can ask the applicant if they are willing to delay. In my 390 opinion, you are being asked to approve what would normally have been an exempt subdivision in Orange County and the 391 only reason you are reviewing it at all is because, as Molly has already pointed out and as detailed in your abstract, is Approved 6/2/21 392 because of the public road being proposed. That is the only reason why we are seeing it. I don't say that to diminish your 393 desire to look for more information, I just want to be factual. 394 395 Charity Kirk: But we can squelch it by not approving it. 396 397 Michael Harvey: As Molly pointed out, and it's in your abstract, you have three options. You can approve and what the 398 approval does is it allows the applicant to move forward,the approval of the Concept Plan does not guarantee a 399 Preliminary Plot gets approved, itjust allows the applicant to continue. There are a lot of factors that might impact Mr. 400 Mitchell being able to move forward that have nothing to do with Orange County, or Chatham County for that matter. 401 There may be DOT issues or well issues. There are a slew of things that could occur. You could approve this with 402 conditions. Those conditions could range from you want more information from Chatham County on the septic permitting 403 process and their review of the septic locations; you want Mr. Mitchell to provide more detail on water usage and ways that 404 water could be conserved;you can ask for additional traffic impact data prior to the Preliminary Plat so that it will help you 405 make a final decision; or your current option is to say that you are not comfortable approving it because you think that the 406 impacts outweigh the benefits and there is a vote. I certainly think that the Board has flexibility on one level to impose 407 some reasonable conditions to ask for more data. I think some of the answers are going to be answered as Mr. Mitchell 408 continues through his review in Chatham County,assuredly I think the Department of Transportation is going to weigh in 409 on any necessary traffic improvements and I think that there can be a condition or request for more water usage data as 410 well as if there is any preliminary well testing or drilling that is done to figure out what water flow is in this area. Those are 411 your three options and I think it is conceivable for you to discuss some conditions with the applicant and either approve, 412 approve with conditions or you can deny. If you do deny then I would ask that you are explicit in your rationale so that Mr. 413 Mitchell has an understanding of what you might need if he chooses to bring this up again after the statutory time has 414 passed to re-propose the development. 415 416 Melissa Poole: Since there are so many new people and we haven't done one of these in a long time,to help understand 417 that this is preliminary concept, this still comes back before us at a later date in more detail. 418 419 Molly Boyle: Yes,that is correct,this is just the Concept Plan and then the applicant would have to come back and apply 420 for a Preliminary Plat and that is when you will see something that looks more like the plat that you are used to with the 421 metes and bounds and certifications. Also at that point you would have more concrete data and review from NCDOT in 422 terms of the public road, any improvements they might require. You are correct once this is the Concept Plan, assuming 423 approved,then Mr. Mitchell would have to apply for a Preliminary Plat and that would go to the Development Advisory 424 (DAC)again and would then come before you again and then it would go on to the Board of County Commissioners. 425 426 Adam Beeman: I would propose since the water is an issue that the developer take the well off Orange County's property 427 all together and find another location in Chatham. That takes it out of our decision-making. Then all we are doing is 428 deciding on a road. 429 430 Charity Kirk: I would still...Orange County and Chatham is just a line. I would still want to know the well status. 431 432 Adam Beeman: We don't control that,that's the definition;we don't have control of that. 433 434 Charity Kirk: We can still approve or deny the road. 435 436 Adam Beeman: I don't agree with that. But I would like to shift the driveway to the left of the utility pole so it doesn't affect 437 the neighbors and move the well off the Orange County parcel. That is my request from the developer, I don't know if the 438 rest of the Board agrees with me. 439 440 Melissa Poole: I agree with Adam. In the conditions for the Preliminary, I would like to see more information about the 441 shifting that road. 442 443 David Blankfard: Will the Orange County residents be able to comment on the Chatham County proposal for 444 development? 445 446 Molly Boyle: I believe anyone within the notification boundary there, in terms of the neighborhood information meetings. 447 Some of the people in Orange County were captured in that so I would assume so but I'm not 100 percent that if they were Approved 6/2/21 448 in the notification boundary they would be able to speak. I believe their notification radius is 500 feet from the property 449 which is the statutory requirement. Orange County doubles it and goes to 1,000 feet but at the bare minimum it's 500 feet. 450 [staff note, in retrospect,the distance required by statute was stated incorrectly; state statutes do not require notifications 451 for subdivisions as statutes allow subdivisions to be approved administratively(no public notice required). In cases of 452 zoning changes,state statutes require that abutting property owners receive mailed notification; local regulations can 453 contain a larger notification boundary,as Orange County does.] 454 455 Carrie Fletcher: My concern, and I agree with Charity, is that just because technically we call it Orange County and our 456 concern is only with Orange County and we can move the well off Orange County so it's not our problem;we are talking 457 about a development that concerns Orange County and Chatham County and my concern is with the people buying these 458 homes and making sure they have access to water and that the people around them also have access to water and you're 459 not cutting off someone's nose to spite your face just because it's not our jurisdiction and that we would leave these people 460 high and dry. I agree with what Lucy said about how the aquifers are tapped because that is my problem on my property 461 is that I am going down among different layers of rock not into an aquifer. I was wondering if the developer could give us 462 some kind of preliminary water drilling information as was proposed. I would be very concerned about that and I would like 463 to feel more comfortable about not impacting water availability to neighborhoods nearby. 464 465 Charity Kirk: I'm willing to approve it moving forward on the condition that we get more information about the status of the 466 water. I'm willing to potentially have a well in Orange County as long as there's information about the wells in that area 467 and the quality. 468 469 David Blankfard: What I've heard so far is we would like the developer to look at headlight beams for the entrance onto 470 Jones Ferry; a traffic study, and the well,water quality and quantity,for wells in this area. 471 472 Whitney Watson: The other thing was water conservation measures for the homes. 473 474 Lamar Proctor: I'm like, I'm on an Orange County Planning Board and I am bringing detriment to Orange County citizens 475 to increase traffic and water use with no benefit to Orange County. I don't understand why I would vote for this. I don't 476 have any incentive to vote for it. I just tell that to Mr. Mitchell, because I appreciate his candor but I want to be candid too. 477 1 don't see what Orange County benefits from this. 478 479 David Blankfard: Not to put words in your mouth but didn't you say that they would be shopping in Carrboro? 480 481 Lamar Proctor: That's not a direct benefit, that's a potential benefit, some shopping but that comes with detriments. It 482 comes with increased traffic on Jones Ferry; it comes with increased population growth. As Chatham blows up, if Orange 483 doesn't do anything and it's just a wall of Chatham along the line, I don't see how that benefits Orange County in any direct 484 way. Is the property going to be preserved as the rest of the 60 acres? Is there going to be something else, another 485 development with expensive homes that would provide a tax base? Yes, there is potential benefit of going to Carrboro and 486 spending money but once again,that's going to benefit Carrboro, I don't know that's going to benefit Orange County. My 487 constituents are Orange County. I'm trying to look at it holistically but if there is no benefit and Orange County is not 488 getting anything out of it then I don't have any incentive to vote for it. 489 490 Randy Marshall: My only comment is that Orange County is bordered by several different other counties and it is 491 incumbent upon us to be as considerate of developments on the other side of the county line as it is for them to be 492 considerate of Orange County developments so I think this is an implied sharing of responsibility when developments 493 cross county lines. I don't think we need to be particularly selfish in terms of looking out for only Orange County because 494 there may be times when we want Chatham County or Durham County or Alamance County to give us some slack and 495 help us approve a development that we would like to have in our County. I am not necessarily in favor of going strictly by 496 what is in it for us. I think you could send it for Chatham to decide as many of the issues we brought up today are issues 497 that Chatham County has to deal with because a lot of those issues are not going to be part of the portion of Orange 498 County that being developed. 499 500 David Blankfard: I think it benefits Wendell Merritt who is an Orange County resident who going to sell this piece of 501 property and he gets to keep the rest of his property to do whatever he wants to do with it. 502 Approved 6/2/21 503 Lamar Proctor: I understand Mr. Marshall's point but it's a commercial development, it's not a public development. It is a 504 completely moneymaking, profiteering, enterprise. I don't know if Chatham or Alamance would do the same, I really don't. 505 506 Warren Mitchell: Something I like to mention Mr. Proctor, it's not a big revelation but it is being developed in the manner 507 that Orange County would develop. It's 50%of open space, its 93 lots where the zoning allows 130. 1 also don't believe 508 Chatham will blow up like you think. There is definitely growth happening in Chatham. Their watershed rules are strict, 509 they are not as strict as University Lake,which has really saved a lot of growth on Jones Ferry but the Chatham rules 510 really guard Jordan Lake. They are very protective of Jordan Lake and Jordan Lake Rules. There is no sewer in Chatham 511 County whatsoever so that really controls Chatham a lot and you have to do a private water system. There has been a 512 few like Governor's Club, Fearrington Village, and Briar Chapel they had their wastewater treated. It's going to be 513 developed in the same way that rural Orange County would develop. Like Molly said, it's one lot for 40,000 square feet so 514 the zoning on this property is the same as the zoning in Orange County. That's just an alternate perspective, it's not to say 515 there is a benefit to Orange County but they are also not running wild across the border. I live in Chatham, I was born in 516 Chapel Hill, I've got perspective in both counties. They just passed their Land Use Plan four years ago and they are trying 517 to create the UDO to implement the Land Use Plan. If you look at it you'll see nothing but green. They are protecting 518 farmland in Chatham,they are protecting all the open space. You would be very impressed with their Land Use Plan. 1 519 am proud to live in Chatham and I think they are doing an excellent job. 520 521 Melissa Poole: Just to clarify,again,our voting on this is a vote to allow the developer to move forward in the process. It 522 is not a vote of yes on the development itself. 523 524 David Blankfard: That's correct. To restate the 4 conditions, 1st is the headlights, investigate the headlights from the exit 525 onto house in front of entrance on Jones Ferry Road. 2nd is the traffic study; 3rd is the information on geology for the 526 aquifer and wells for these two parcels and 4th is the water conservation measures. 527 528 MOTION by Randy Marshall to recommend approval with the 4 added conditions . Seconded by Adam Beeman. 529 530 Adam Beeman: Yes 531 Susan Hunter: Yes 532 Charity Kirk Yes 533 Carrie Fletcher Yes 534 Lamar Proctor Yes 535 Melissa Poole: Yes 536 Whitney Watson Yes 537 Randy Marshall: Yes 538 Alexandra Allman Yes 539 David Blankfard: Yes 540 MOTION PASSED UNANIMOUSLY 541 542 543 AGENDA ITEM 8: ADJOURNMENT 544 Meeting was adjourned by consensus at 8:30 p.m. 545 546 547 548 549 David Blankfard, Chair