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HomeMy WebLinkAboutSWAB minutes 020708 Minutes - Regular Meeting Solid Waste Advisory Board February 7, 2008 Approved April 3, 2008 Attendance : Jan Sassaman, Bonnie Norwood, BJ Tipton, Linda Bowerman, Al Vickers, and Michelle Grunwald Staff: Blair Pollock, Paul Spire, Wanda McCain, and Nicole Ard Guest: Marty Hanks and Marc ter Horst 1 . Adoption of Minutes from December 6 SWAB meeting Norwood moves to accept. Vickers 2nd . Passes unanimously 2 . Board Member Comments Norwood states that one of the new men at the Eubanks Rd . site is excellent. I called to have some yard debris to be picked up that was dumped on the side of the road . By the time I had made my circle and come back it was gone . Vickers states that I have received a couple of emails from Carrboro residents with complaints about the smell on Eubanks Rd . Spire states that when it' s really damp the smell is bad . The more we put in there the more methane gas it produces . There will just be times when it' s bad . We applied some odor neutralizers for about ninety days but those were not successful . Sassaman states that I ' ve been reappointed by Chapel Hill to a three-year term . I am their sole representative on the solid waste advisory board . 3 . Election of Board Chair and Establishment of Meeting Schedule for 2008 Sassaman states that this being the beginning of the year and having another member on the board, it would be a good time to elect another chair or reaffirm that you want to use the chair that' s already there . Norwood nominates Jan [Sassaman] . Vickers 2nd . Passes unanimously . Sassaman states that we don' t have an official vice-chair . I would like to have one . Tipton asks what would the vice-chair do . Sassaman states that the vice -chair would chair the meeting in my absence and help out in general . 1 Minutes - Regular Meeting Solid Waste Advisory Board February 7, 2008 Approved April 3, 2008 Pollock states that typically in addition to chairing the meetings, the staff and the chair sit down and talk through the agenda and presentations a week or so before the meetings . Grunwald states that I don ' t know the background of people enough to nominate someone . I don ' t know who is too busy . I know that I don ' t have the time . How can we talk this through? Sassaman states that I was going to suggest Al Vickers because he has been involved in this since its inception . Norwood states that I nominate Al too because he always volunteers for stuff that we don' t have any idea about. Sassaman calls for vote and Vickers ' nomination is passed unanimously 4 . Citizen Presentation - Bio Energy Center, Marc ter Horst ter Horst states Marty Hanks, his business partner who is present, is also a developer of this idea . We had spoken with Mike Nelson and Barry Jacobs who asked that we speak with you all first. Hanks states that what we were looking to do is look at an opportunity to solve multiple environmental concerns . It is a business theory . The goal is to make it as carbon neutral as possible . We would look at a business model that is community based opportunity that we developed through the Kenan-Flagler business school at UNC . Orange County and surrounding counties would have the opportunity to contribute to it. We are looking to replace coal and boiler fuel . Hanks and ter Horst describe a zvood fuel production facility that might use zvaste zvood from the surrounding areas to make boiler ficel or zvood stove pellet fuel from pulverized zvood . They describe hozv much zvood feedstock is available zvithin various distances from Orange County from zvaste zvood, lozv -grade timber and silvicultural wastes . ter Horst states that the other product we ' d like to work on is biodiesel . It is a mixture of chemicals that you can burn instead of petroleum that is derived from vegetable oil mixed with glycerin. It is a grown fuel and in the US it is at 1 . 6 million gallons production [as of] last year . You can make it from fryer grease, sunflower oil, or other oil crops . The format that we are looking at is modeled after Piedmont Biofuels in Pittsboro . They are gradually improving the bioreactor to decrease water use, increase efficiency, etc . They then describe the biodiesel process in some detail . 2 Minutes - Regular Meeting Solid Waste Advisory Board February 7, 2008 Approved April 3, 2008 Vickers asks if you talked to the State air pollution agency about the practicalities of burning wood fuel . There is higher particulate emission from wood than from coal, oil or gas . ter Horst states that it would be an improvement for homeowners using wood stoves . It improves on the emissions . The combustion is more efficient than an open fireplace or hearth . Grunwald notes it reduces the pollution already there . Sassaman asks what is it that you want from this group . Why are you here ? You have informed us and we can give you lots of ideas, but what is it that brought you id Waste Advisory Board . specifically to the Sol Hanks states that we wanted to see what we would have to do for this to become viable in the county . See what your response is and see what you can do [if you] have more information provided . Sassaman clarifies what do you want of the Solid Waste Advisory Board in a broader context of the solid waste operation and the landfill . Do you want to locate where the landfill is ? Do you want yard waste ? What is it that you are asking for ? Our response to you will be different depending on what you want. Do you want to put a facility on Eubanks Road? Hanks replies yes we would like to have a facility . We would need 10 acres adjacent to the landfill . Sassaman asks Board member Bowerman her opinion of a facility that would bring more materials into that area, perhaps 100, 000 tons a year . They clarify that ter Horst and Hanks are discussing the parcel of land for sale adjacent to the railroad tracks ter Horst replies, Yes we would love to have a place beside or near it. We are also looking elsewhere in the County to see what' s viable economically . Sassaman states that you are aware of the waste transfer station issue . One of the big problems is the volume of trucks that will pass through there, which are incrementally not much compared to what you would have and even if you don ' t have trucks, you' d have rail which would increase the rail traffic . The other question I have is that the yard waste that we have is a marketable product for us . Hanks replies that we are not looking for you all to give that to us for free . We would maybe set up a long-term contract where we pay to take it out two times a day . 3 Minutes - Regular Meeting Solid Waste Advisory Board February 7, 2008 Approved April 3, 2008 Norwood asks about the cost of a pellet stove [to burn their product. ] Hanks replies $1 , 500 to $2, 000 . The discussion shifts to biodeisel . Mention was made of the Town of Chapel Hill using biodiesel in their buses, but they do not. They use low sulfur diesel fuel . Vickers asks if you plan to set up as a competition with Piedmont with the biodiesel or expanding their operation. ter Horst states that we have talked for a while on different scenarios of whether we would hire them as a consultant or consider a franchise but we plan on working with them . Vickers asks with the landfill gas what do you plan to do, convert that to biodiesel or forming pellets or it' s a combined mixture of whatever energy resources can be used together . ter Horst states that we would like to use electricity to run pumps and heat to dry the biomass to compact to make the pellets . The heat would heat the vegetable oil to accelerate the biodiesel reaction. If there is more heat, we can recover more methanol from the biodiesel making process . Norwood states that you guys said you want to be educated -- forget Eubanks Rd . idered the competition for resources that you are Grunwald asks if you have cons going to be trying to purchase . Have you tried to buy sawdust in Orange County? Hanks states that we have found several wood companies that have people come up it in their trucks . They give it away .and dump Grunwald notes that they' re not in the loop with the horse barns . Pollock notes there is a lot of interest in capturing carbon credits and reducing the county' s carbon footprint among governments in Orange County and the University, but what if there is no way to get a facility to work on Eubanks Road, where would you do this . Vickers notes that the County has given up on siting a landfill and has a hard time siting anything to do with waste . 4 Minutes - Regular Meeting Solid Waste Advisory Board February 7, 2008 Approved April 3, 2008 ter Horst notes that there is a lot of interest among several of the Commissioners in this and we will followup whether or not a facility is permitted at the landfill or anywhere in Orange County . Sassaman notes there are not many places in the County with the intersection of rail, road and other corridors needed for this type of development. 5 . Solid Waste Management Plan Work Group Process - Status Report Pollock states that there are three important things . One is that the work group recommendation to proceed with Phase I consolidating the shipment of recyclables from the existing recycling area at the landfill is going to the Board on the 19th. The corollary piece is that we suggested to the Board that they don ' t have to fret about whether to build a materials recovery facility or not. We can ship materials out for the time being and look at how that works . The second thing that is going on with the plan is that I just finalized the survey for the solid waste hauling and collection option . Over the next two to three weeks businesses will have the opportunity to log onto the [Survey Monkey] site and express their opinions about the types of solid waste and recycling they have now and how much it costs and what they ' d like to see . You all are welcomed to look at the survey, but unless you own or operate a business, we ask that you not take the survey . Pollock adds that there is a set of questions around how to set up recycling including should there be a franchise, should recycling be mandatory with any licensed company collecting. The third thing is looking at what the next several steps are before getting the plan done . We have to look at the overall financing package and other steps to develop an overall game plan for you to comment on. We hope to have that meeting in March . Tipton asks how the survey will be distributed . Pollock states that it will be solicited through both Chambers of Commerce, the Orange County Economic Development Office, and the Carrboro Business Association. 6 . Extending Landfill Capacity - Staff Memorandum to BOCC Pollock states that last fall Commissioner Nelson asked us to look at bans on landfilling various materials as a way to extend landfill life at least until the transfer station is built. The commissioners received the memo as an informational report and took no action . The board chair decided that this should go in front of the work group . We don' t think it is philosophically right or practical to ban our way to our goal . We can' t police everything in the garbage . One waste collector pays the landfill penalty for having cardboard in his load rather than abandon his customers who refuse to recycle their 5 Minutes - Regular Meeting Solid Waste Advisory Board February 7, 2008 Approved April 3, 2008 cardboard . One item we do think the ban would be effective for is residential is it would still have to be cut down . corrugated cardboard . The downside Sassaman asks is there are any other ways to pick up the cardboard without having to cut it. Pollock replies no . Tipton asks what about running a separate truck . Pollock replies then it becomes how much energy do you put into recycling for the environmental benefits ? Norwood asks isn' t it shredded . Could the truck have a shredder on it? Pollock replies it' s pulped . Norwood asks is there a shredder a homeowner could buy . Pollock replies not for corrugated cardboard . Grunwald asks if having a negative ban complemented with a positive reward for cooperation been considered . If they have to pay extra for doing curbside, could they get credit for their recycling at the convenience centers and it all come out in the wash in taxes ? Pollock asks how would you do that. Grunwald replies a punch card . Each person has a unique punch card . Pollock states that Gaston County uses a punch card when you bring your waste in . You pay for a punch card so that when you bring in your recycling you are exempted from getting your card punched . Grunwald states that the big problem is like a double whammy to say we are going to pass laws that are going to confine you even more and now we are going to charge you for supporting these laws . A ban is a law . Pollock describes the other options including recycling at dropoff sites of rigid plastics id plastics . The need is to have a baler that like large buckets, toys and other bulky rig can make a dense enough bale to make weight on a truck . Our baler does not. Everything we will want to do has a cost. The combination of some measures to save landfill space and the time to implement them could just about bridge the time gap 6 Minutes - Regular Meeting Solid Waste Advisory Board February 7, 2008 Approved April 3, 2008 between when we now predict the landfill will close and the transfer station could be finished . Things that are smaller than cardboard are hard to detect to ban . When a truck contains a lot of cardboard, you know it. Once you ban things at a residence, it' s hard to police all those roll carts . Vickers points out that it is especially hard with the automated carts they use in Carrboro . 7. BOCC Request for Technology Assessment of Landfill Alternatives Sassaman states that the Board would like us to look at potential technology for disposing of solid waste that is an alternative to landfill . The question that I ' ve raised is how are we going to do that? There are a lot of technologies out there . But how are we going to evaluate the technical issues, scientific issues, and financial issues, etc . One possibility is to request some assistance consulting through the solid waste office . Some of my thought processes are there are a bunch of incineration technologies . The questions I would ask include : The maturity of the technology - we do not want an experimental technology to handle our waste, Public acceptability - what technology would the public in Orange County like, Space needed - ten acres, 1 , 000 acres, What is the fee and level of tonnage for economic viability, Is it easy to use, What kinds of extra fees and technology would we need to operate it, Could Orange County own and operate it, Is it readily permittable here, Is it a facility that can handle our waste . and what kind of residuals are generated . Norwood states that the issue of bringing outside trash in to feed an incinerator, we didn' t want to do that before . With the carbon trash do you want more stuff on Eubanks , . . . The issue of placing it [raises] concerns of the surrounding areas [with respect to] the fumes of it, that was brought up before . Who would control it, we don ' t have the knowledge so we would have to learn, how much control would we have over an outside company . If an outside company came in we would not be in control . How much money would it save over the transfer station? What would it cost to set it up . Grunwald states that the first thing I think when I hear incineration is toxic sludge . When you were going through your list the problem with all the issues seems to boil down to " not in Orange County " . Has it been considered for a cooperative effort with a neighboring county ? There are other surrounding counties other than Durham . Sassaman states that one of the things I' ve thought about when I think of this is a regional facility . Vickers points out that Wake County has their own landfill and has ruled out others . 7 Minutes - Regular Meeting Solid Waste Advisory Board February 7, 2008 Approved April 3, 2008 Tipton states that we are talking about a new technology that we don' t know the name of so my first question is what about the [State] Solid Waste Division and asking them what they' ve seen, what they think, think outside the box, there are creative things out there now, can we afford them, I have no idea . Not looking at options will create more of a political issue than looking at them . Spire states that there is a consultant working with the BOCC on the criteria for the transfer station. That is going to determine what ever the type of solid waste facility built in Orange County possibly for years to come . The consultant is already under contract you could piggyback on their process . Norwood states that this seems like this is one of those issues where the commissioners just wants us to feed them and we don t get any feedback . They just want some ideas to go on. Sassaman states that they are responding to a lot of people who have said to ship the material out of the county is unethical . Is there any alternative that we might look at that is viable and feasible for Orange County ? Norwood states that we could send them a list of, not a lot of information, but just send them something and ask them to pick out what they are interested in. We have been through this with the landfill site search . Sassaman suggests a simple approach for arraying the technologies including maturity, experience in other places, amount of storage capacity, etc . Grunwald states that my big questions would be why did they come up with this, why do they want this, what are the chances of anything really happening . As a voluntary advisory board can we say ' no thank you . ' It would be a huge waste of time and money to come up with this consultancy if we are just going through a feel good process that is going to get rejected . Sassaman states that they are genuinely interested to an alternative to shipping material out of the county . We cant sit on the notion that ' we tried it 25 years ago and it didn t work' . Technologies change and I hear more and more the argument that it' s nities . We are recycling more and there is a lot unethical to dump on other commu less mercury and lead which are issues to think about if we consider incineration . Pollock asks if the board wants to make this an action item . Norwood asks do we pick a number we want the consultants to look at and do we give them a timeframe of when we want the information back . 8 Minutes - Regular Meeting Solid Waste Advisory Board February 7, 2008 Approved April 3, 2008 Sassaman suggests they do a preliminary screening type analysis and identify the major technologies according to whatever criteria plus whatever they might want to come up with and have in mind about how much money to spend . Or ask them to tell us how much we would get for $2, 000 or $10, 000 . Norwood asks do we take that information to the commissioners and say do you want $2, 000 or $10, 000 and chip in the other $8, 000 . Sassaman states that we should wait to see what Gayle can do . Vickers moves to ask Gayle to talk to the consultant about the cost of doing a screening of six most practical ways of disposing waste in the county . Norwood 2nd Vote passes 5 - 0 . 8 . Programs/Services Update Solid Waste Operations Center Spire states that they are beginning to start the construction process . The have surveyed out and put stakes for reference points . There is a nine-month build process . Landfill Leachate Sezver Project Pollock states that we are in the final stages of trying to negotiate the access of some of the land with one of the landowners five years after we started trying to pump leachate to the sewage treatment plant. If we are not gaining access, we will have to go back to the attorney to ask how to successful acquire the right of way to proceed across that property . Orange County Comprehensive Plan Pollock states that you all weighed in last year that solid waste issues need to kept from being zoned out, or legislated out of existence . The next meeting is April 3rd and zoning and land use regulations adopted in the plan will affect how solid waste facilities are located . Interim Solid Waste Management Report The staff is working on this for the next meeting . Landfill Gas Recovery Project is in negotiation with the University and there is a ninety day time frame to come up with an agreement. The sooner the gas capture agreement is in place, the sooner a system can be established and the sooner the odor problem can be solved as a gas capture system puts a negative pressure on the gas sucking it down into the pipes instead of venting to the atmosphere . 9 Minutes - Regular Meeting Solid Waste Advisory Board February 7, 2008 Approved April 3, 2008 Other None 9 . Other Business Sassaman states that we need to talk about the schedule . We typically meet on the first Thursday of the month . We have covered a lot of material today . We probably don t' have an egregious amount of material to cover the next time unless we want to do followup on technology assessment. One option is to have a Joint scheduling of our meeting followed by the work group . We could meet an hour before or after the work group meeting or we keep the regular meeting . Group agrees not to meet on March 6 . Vickers moves to adjourn . Adjourn: 9 : 30pm Next meeting : April 3 , 2008 Southern Human Services, Chapel Hill 10