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HomeMy WebLinkAboutMinutes - 20060313APROVED 5/1612006 MINUTES ORANGE COUNTY BOARD OF COMMISSIONERS WORK SESSION March 13, 2006 7:30 p.m. The Orange County Board of Commissioners met for a Work Session on Monday, March 13, 2006 at 7:30 p.m. at the Government Services Center in Hillsborough, North Carolina. COUNTY COMMISSIONERS PRESENT: Chair Barry Jacobs and Commissioners Moses Carey, Jr., Valerie P. Foushee, Alice M. Gordon, and Stephen H. Halkiotis COUNTY COMMISSIONERS ABSENT: COUNTY ATTORNEYS PRESENT: Geof Gledhill and Sean Borhanian COUNTY STAFF PRESENT: County Manager Jahn M. Link, Jr., Assistant County Manager Rod Visser and Clerk to the Board Donna Baker (All other staff members will be identified appropriately below) NOTE: ALL DOCUMENTS REFERRED TO IN THESE MINUTES ARE IN THE PERMANENT AGENDA FILE IN THE CLERK'S OFFICE. ALL RECORDINGS OF THE MEETING WILL BE KEPT FOR 5 YEARS. Chair Jacobs made reference to the update on the email upgrade within the County government. There was also a printout of the written responses from the County Commissioners regarding school funding equity. There were also draft minutes from the February 16t" work session at which they discussed these same issues. 1. Continuation of Discussion Regarding School Equity Considerations Commissioner Halkiotis said that the County Commissioners had requested more supporting information such as how much each school system is spending on SRO's, social workers, nurses, etc. Rod Visser said that staff had provided this information previously and it was not reissued. Commissioner Halkiotis said that he asked Superintendent Carraway on February 16t" and she did not have an answer, and he thought that it had not been provided and that it was going to be part of the discussion. Chair Jacobs read from page five of the minutes: "Commissioner Halkiotis said that the OCS board, many years ago, made a decision to fund nurses out of their own budget. He thinks it is important to note that OCS chose to spend mare money on nurses. He wants to know what they are actually spending for nurses today. He thinks this is an important piece of the equity argument - if students have equal access to health." He said that they need some updated numbers. Commissioner Gordon said that she remembers that they did get information on February 16t", but it was not complete and so they asked for more complete information. Commissioner Halkiotis read from the draft minutes on page five, line 24: "Commissioner Gordon said that she would like to know who paid for the school nurses for each school system and the total amount spent far school nurses, social workers, and any other positions." John Link said that he is sure that the two school boards will be happy to get them the information. Chair Jacobs said that page five has a pretty good rendering of what the County Commissioners asked for. He suggested that everyone read this part and ask staff to gather the information. He pointed out that Commissioner Halkiotis also asked questions about square feet of heated and cooled space. Chair Jacobs said that they do have some information in the form of responses from the school boards to the questions that were posed. He said that the County Commissioners posed these questions to themselves as well as the school boards. The Board solicited comment from the school boards in the spirit of working with them in a collaborative manner and out of respect that they have a statutory authority that the County Commissioners do not have. He said that this process has not been characterized accurately in the media. He wants to be clear that the County Commissioners did not send out an assignment that they were not willing to complete themselves. Chair Jacobs said that there was no unanimity on the Board of County Commissioners either about haw to proceed, but they did generally agree on tenets regarding school equity, and did not agree on the issue of going outside the per pupil and haw to do this. These discussions are reflected in the minutes. He said that, with his reading of the school letters, there was some limited agreement that perhaps funding outside the per pupil would be considered for SROs and school nurses. He said that this was the limit of the conversation on the alternatives for funding. Chair Jacobs said that, regarding the question of if OCS needed more funding for the schools, the OCS Board thought this was humorous but at least agreed on something unanimously. He said that the OCS's attitude toward funding has changed a lot since he became a County Commissioner and they do want and need more funding. Commissioner Carey said that, in view of the lack of subsequent information they asked for, he wonders what they can discuss tonight as a Board to move along on this discussion. He thinks that all agree that the ultimate decision is with the Board of County Commissioners on what to do about school equity. He said that they need this additional information from staff before they can decide whether to move forward on alternative financing outside the per pupil. Chair Jacobs said that there is not much to do other than to direct staff to research the areas of commonality of SROs/crossing guards and nurses. He said that Commissioner Gordon had asked who funded these positions and that the information be put in a chart. He said that he and Commissioner Carey worked for a while with both school systems to come up with a process whereby they are spending in excess of $500,000 to fund nurses. He thinks that this has shown to be a way in which the County has not reduced school funding, but has freed up other monies that the school systems can use for educational purposes. There was some concern in the letters from the school systems that the County might be doing what the legislature has done. He said that the County Commissioners would not do to other people what they resent other people doing to them. They do have the courage to raise taxes if necessary. Commissioner Halkiotis asked that they look at the utility bills at both school systems, because the State turned aver the payment of these bills to the school systems. He wants to look at the possibility of the County paying for part of the utility bills. Commissioner Carey said that he and Chair Jacobs did participate in discussions of outside funding for school nurses awhile back. He said that he is not a supporter of the outside per pupil funding except for this one-time funding for nurses. He said that Commissioner Halkiotis is right about utilities and as long as this Board is sitting here, they will not play a shell game as the State does. He thinks that they risk crossing the line into the statutory responsibility of the schools when they talk about outside of the per pupil funding. He thinks it would be asking for a mess. He said that the CHCCS board tried to stay within health and safety issues as far as the outside per pupil funding suggestions. He said that many families might use this as an outlet to get money under the pretense of health and safety issues. Another concern that he has is the idea of line item budgeting of the schools by the Board of County Commissioners. Another Board may be sitting here in the future and may feel differently about doing line item budgeting for school boards. Commissioner Gordan said that she had misgivings about going outside the per pupil funding and that it could cut into the school board's authority. As she read the letters from the school boards, her misgivings increased. She thinks that the most straightforward way to address the item of equity is to use the per pupil mechanism and allow the school boards to have their traditional authority. She said that it would be better for them to respect the school baards' authority and to raise the per pupil to cover their expenses. If the Board does decide to go outside the per pupil funding, then it should be kept to the traditional county functions of health and social services, which would involve positions such as nurses, Student Resource Officers (SROs) and social workers. She said that, if they do this over time, they may cut the school baards' authority and this could be dangerous. She said that if the County Commissioners want to discuss this, she suggests they venture carefully outside the per pupil funding, if they decide to do this at all. Commissioner Foushee said that she would like to entertain the opportunity to keep the discussion open for the possibility of funding health and safety issues outside the per pupil funding. She is struggling with how to move the discussian forward because of the defeat of the referendum of the OCS. She has a question about how to talk about providing additional resources without levying additional taxes. If they are going to talk about increasing the per pupil allocation, then this brings to mind the opportunity to look at Commissioner Cordon's proposal about a supplemental tax. She said that the funding cannot be separated out of the discussian of defining equity. Commissioner Carey asked about the tax that Commissioner Foushee was referring to and if it was a countywide tax and Commissioner Foushee said yes, it was a countywide supplemental tax. Commissioner Gordon said that it was equivalent to an ad valorem tax and both school systems would have to agree. There would still have to be a referendum. It would still be a tax increase. Commissioner Halkiotis said that he visited the Chapel Hill newspaper website recently and now over 3,000 people had voted in the survey about a district tax, and 89°~ of people voted yes, that the people in the southern end of the County would support a district tax for the OCS. He said that this is nothing new. He said that bonds have always been supported by the southern part of the County. He said that there would have to be a tax somewhere. Chair Jacobs said that there has been a downward slope where the State is providing less and less money for schools and the counties are providing more and more money for schools. He said that Commissioner Gordan had asked about information about outside agency funding for school children and they need this again. He said that, by his recollection, four County Commissioners had proposed countywide supplemental school taxes for funding. He said that he knew that the people in one school system could essentially dictate to the other school system if it were put to a countywide vote, and it was a somewhat disingenuous way to accomplish raising taxes. Chair Jacobs said that his sense of the advantage of going outside the per pupil is to be able to fund bath school systems equally. He said that he also remembers that when they had the discussion about nurses that it was pointed out that the OCS had traditionally funded nurses more than the CHCCS. This is the school system that falls shorter in funding its total budget. He said that outside the per pupil funding could work and he would like to see the contract they do have with the nurses. He said if they went this way, it would take three boards to change it. If everyone could agree to stick with health, safety, and welfare, then it could be funded outside of the per pupil. This would free up money for both school systems to apply to other educational purposes. He suggested that they have a venue where the chairs and the vice-chairs of the three boards meet with a mediator and discuss if there is any agreement an funding outside the per pupil on nurses, SROs, etc. If there is interest, then they could look at a contract and bring it back to their respective boards. He would like to take advantage of the school collaboration group. Commissioner Gordon said that going outside the per pupil would make the two school systems equal an the issues of health and safety, but the rest of it would still be unequal. She does not see how this makes any progress in equity. Commissioner Carey said that he had a similar concern. He does not object to the school collaboration task force discussing the issue and coming back with a recommendation, but there is a very large list of issues for this group to discuss. Commissioner Halkiatis asked Commissioner Gordon and Commissioner Carey what they would like to see. He asked if they would like to see atwo-cent property tax increase to benefit OCS and then atwo-cent decrease in the CHCCS district tax. Commissioner Carey said that if they are not going to merge the two school systems, the only other way to begin to move in the right direction is to increase the general property tax and reduce the CHCCS district tax in a way that does not harm either school system. Commissioner Halkiotis asked who would have to agree to implement the countywide supplemental tax. It was answered the Board of County Commissioners. Commissioner Foushee said that budget time is drawing nigh and they need to move forward. She said that if they are going to move towards providing an equitable situation far school districts, they need to talk about how they are going to do it, and this simply means more taxes. Chair Jacobs asked Geof Gledhill if pursuing a countywide supplemental school tax would be in the County Commissioners' purview to put on the ballot and Geaf Gledhill said yes. Geof Gledhill said that a countywide supplemental tax would have to be allocated per pupil between the two school systems, and although the school districts do not have to agree on the amount of the supplemental tax, the tax has to be set at the lowest rate requested. In effect, one school system could veto the supplemental tax by requesting "0". John Link suggested discussing this an Wednesday night since the Board will be discussing major budget drivers far 2006-07. The County is already looking at a large increase of possibly 10-11 cents, and this does not include frivolous or unnecessary items. It includes some funding for the school systems but not all that they will probably ask for. He said that if the OCS asks fora $3 million increase, then the CHCCS will probably ask far a $4+ million increase. He said that there is validity in looking at bath options for funding -per pupil and outside the per pupil. He said that $500,000 put toward health, safety, and welfare could ga a long way toward funding the one aspect of nurses, SROs, etc. Commissioner Gordan said that the essential financial reality is that when you raise the property tax and reduce the district tax and hold CHCCS harmless, the only tax increase is in the OCS. She said that in the long term, if you only raise taxes and decrease the district tax, this would eventually no longer hold CHCCS harmless. She asked if there was some indication that the OCS property owners want the County to da this. It is a balancing act of funding far schools and the County. She would like to take some small step this year. She thinks that a supplemental tax will have to come another year because time is running out. She wants to talk to bath school boards about it. Commissioner Halkiotis said that they have talked to both school systems and they need to move forward. He said that salary increases for teachers will be coming down this year and the County has no control over it. He said that if they can do something small this year, then they could plan a referendum in the future. He thinks that they have talked about this enough. Chair Jacobs said that there is agreement that they want to do something for the schools this year but not profoundly, he suggested raising the issue at the Schaal collaboration task force regarding outside the per pupil for the short term. If there is no agreement, he will come back with other options within their fiscal reality this budget year. The Board agreed. Commissioner Halkiotis said to separate taxing authority from planning authority. Chair Jacobs said that there is agenda review an April 3rd and they will ask staff to provide all of the requested information and will make sure that it is efficient. 2. Confirmation of Timetable for CHCCS Elementary # 10 Rod Visser said that he and other staff attended a Carrboro Board of Alderman meeting recently and discussed the Twin Creeks campus and it was fairly positively received. This has some impact on CHCCS Elementary School #10, which is slated to go on the educational campus portion of the Twin Creeks property. There has also been discussion about a first school proposal that CHCCS has been discussing with the University for age 3 through 2nd grade. This would affect the need far buildings and elementary school capacity. Also, the first meeting in April, they expect to bring back the annual report from the Schools Adequate Public Facilities Ordinance Technical Advisory Committee. At this time, the most pressing question is when elementary school space will be needed and it appears that it would need to open as early as 2007-08. There was also same discussion about haw the Twin Creeks campus might be presented far development review. Commissioner Carey asked the CHCCS school board chair and Superintendent to come forward. Chair Jacobs said that at the Carrboro meeting, that Carrboro seemed content to review this as one project. The Mayor raised the passibility of drawing a line where the connector road goes in such a way that the government did not have to pay for the whole thing. This was very positive and the Board of Aldermen was supportive. Steve Scroggs said that their concern is with the hydrology and the approval process of the entire site. He said that it was the Town of Carrboro that suggested they separate the elementary and middle school sites. This would allow them to move an the fast track because there will be a prototype on the site. Superintendent Pedersen said that the elementary school is needed in 2007. If the property were not split up, then it could not open until 2009 at the earliest. Chair Jacobs asked how this fits with the First School. Superintendent Pedersen said that as they have gotten more detail from the University, it looks like 2009 will not be realistic. They are still in discussions. He is convinced that they need a school as soon as possible and the timeline is mare favorable at Twin Creeks. John Link said that the drop-dead date is based on when the funding is available. He asked Rod Visser and Donna Dean when the County could incur the additional debt for Elementary School #10 and Donna Dean said 2008-09. There is $12.8 million calculated in the debt schedule as it stands now for Elementary School #10. John Link said that there is a date that they can work back from to when the building can be paid for and determine when you have to have approvals to build the school. Commissioner Carey said that the County Commissioners need to see these timelines. Commissioner Gordon said that it is important to realize that Elementary School #10 is not exempt from the adequate public facilities ordinance. She said that they have not changed the capacities for the SAPFO to track with the new State mandates. The SAPFO would require that this schaal be built at a certain time, and they need to know what this time is. Chair Jacobs said that one element of SAPFO is that it includes the possibility of stopping development. The Board has never talked about this, but it is there. The County Commissioners need to see drop dead dates from old and new formulas. Commissioner Halkiotis asked what it would cost to replicate Rashkis on this site and Steve Scroggs said $23 million, without a connector road. Superintendent Pedersen made reference to splitting up the site and said that there are a number of ways to build a school, and given that they are replicating the Rashkis model and that if splitting up the site will allow them to fast track, they should da all they can that will allow this school to come online as soon as possible. Chair Jacobs asked about impervious surface and if this would be a problem an the upper part of the site and Steve Scraggy said that this would not be a problem. Discussion ensued about impervious surface. Steve Scroggs said that the school board policy requires that there be no increase in storm water runoff in their sites. Chair Jacobs asked the County staff and the school staff to confer with the Carrboro Planning staff to calculate the impervious surface on 191 acres because it seems crazy to have to build retention ponds on the upper part because it is separated from the lower part, which is primarily undisturbed natural area. This would more than make up for the overall calculation of impervious surface. If Carrboro is willing to work with them and it would not delay the process, it would save some money in construction of the school. Commissioner Halkiotis asked Planning Director Craig Benedict about current regulations regarding rain capturing capacity in the impervious surface considerations and Craig Benedict said that certain regulations say that if BMPs are in there, you can increase the percentage of impervious surface because of water quality compensation. Commissioner Halkiotis asked if the County's regulations discuss capturing rainwater and putting it in underground cisterns to flush toilets and it was answered no. Steve Scroggs said that the school system would not get credit on the impervious surface far capturing rainwater. Chair Jacobs said that there are several items -timeline, decision from CHCCS about priorities, and organizing a meeting with Carrboro and also inviting the Mayor. Steve Scroggs said that they would get to the point of denying CAPs relatively soon. If the projections are correct, they will start denying CAPS in 2007-2008. Commissioner Gordon asked if there was a definitive decision of the CHCCS board about First School versus Elementary School #10 and CHCCS Board Chair Lisa Stuckey said that they would be reaching a decision in April. 3. Master Plan Process -New Hope Park at Blackwood Farm Chair Jacobs said that Spence Dickenson came to the regular meeting to talk about this item and it got delayed and he is here tonight. Environment and Resource Conservation Director Dave Stancil said that this was on the March 2"d agenda and is designed to establish a process for the New Hope Park at Blackwood Farm. This is located midway between Hillsborough and Chapel Hill on NC 86. This is a 152- acre property and has virtually every criteria in the Lands Legacy program. There is the old farmstead and several out buildings. There is a pond an the north central portion of the property and fields right beside I-40. There are also intermittent streams that feed the New Hope Creek. He said that when the Board purchased the property in 2001, it was discussed that this would be a low impact park and that it would also be wise to retain some of the important agricultural, historic, and scenic components already present. He said that this would be the next master plan, followed by the joint New Hope Preserve master plan with Durham County, City of Durham, Town of Chapel Hill, and other partners. The timetable proposes to take advantage of scheduling issues. They hope to try and have a task farce appointed in May and break for the summer because they will need to conduct surveys for the master plan. He made reference to the guiding principles and goals in the abstract. The proposed committee is on page 3, which includes representatives of the advisory boards, two County Commissioners, four citizens, Agricultural Preservation Board, Historic Preservation Commission, and others. The staff is asking the Board to discuss/approve the master plan process and authorize the proposed committee. He said that he and Spence Dickenson have spoken and he and other staff are to meet with him to incorporate some of his ideas. Chair Jacobs suggested that for guiding principles, that it says, "The County shall be compensated for uses of the property far "profit" purposes. Recreation and Parks Director Lori Taft said that there would be same concern about the future with groups wanting to use these spaces for recreational purposes for profit rather than agriculture. Commissioner Gordon said that the guiding principles are far the master plan process and they need them also for the operations of the property. Chair Jacobs suggested that they start developing this list of guiding principles for operations of the property. Public Comment Spence Dickenson pointed out Blackwood Farm on a map. He said that a lot of this area was at one time in one farm. He said that looking at a larger picture of what was there is important before things get divided back down into ten-acre farms. He said that he is involved with a group called HUB Sustainability Network, which is looking at what other things could be done here to preserve and provide educational programs, more than just what the County can do. He said that there are opportunities to work with the local schools to educate children about farms. He would like to look at how this large area can be used and find out what other groups out there could be involved. He distributed a copy of his statement. Chair Jacobs suggested that Spence Dickenson apply to be an the planning group for the park. Dave Stancil said that in this particular case, given the nature of the property, it would be appropriate to look at the role agriculture could play as part of the park. There are parks that are living farms. Spence Dickenson said that he talked with Bob Strayhorn about growing demonstration projects and he agreed with starting to prepare this land for demonstration projects. The Board agreed to add this to the consent agenda on March 21St and start advertising for participants of the task force. 4. Interlocal Agreement between the Town of Hillsborough and Orange County for National Pollutant Discharge Elimination System Phase II Services Craig Benedict said that Hillsborough is now subject to the NPDES Phase II, and it was going to hire someone on its staff to operate this program. Orange County Erosion Control presently does a good portion of similar work far Hillsborough at this time. Orange County can do this service as an expansion to the storm water and erosion control regulations to fulfill the obligations of Hillsborough. This will not be developer funded, but funded from Hillsborough. Hillsborough is now subject to it because it has a storm water system within its operation. Erosion Control will be doing public education and outreach on storm water projects and will evaluate all projects before and after construction. Hillsborough will pay Orange County in the first year $37,000, which will go into a fund that will make the cost of the Erasion Control division less from the County's general fund. Next year Hillsborough will pay the County $57,000 for the services. If the County ever has to hire a new person to run the program, Hillsborough would have to fund it completely. Commissioner Halkiotis verified that the County would be fully compensated far all costs (vehicles, special equipment, operating costs, materials, etc.). He said that he has been impressed by the Inspections staff. He gave an example of Home Depot and said that it was about $37,000 in County costs to do all of the inspections for this building and the County recovered $34-35,000 in fees. He encouraged Craig Benedict to think high on these fees. Commissioner Gordon said that this is a win-win situation and she wants to make sure all costs are covered. Chair Jacobs suggested putting the memorandum of agreement on the consent agenda far March 21St. He said that there were some concerns raised to him about the separate special fund, so he asked that Craig Benedict meet with County Attorney Geof Gledhill, Budget Director Donna Dean, and Finance Director Ken Chavious to work this through. The concern is that they do not usually set up separate funds for departments. The money usually goes into the general fund and then the County Commissioners decide whether the money goes back to the department. John Link said that he would like to be involved with this and he said that this concept is similar to a revaluation fund for tax assessments. Commissioner Gordon said that it does not seem to be a bad thing conceptually, but surpluses might need to be under the purview of the County Commissioners. Commissioner Carey suggested looking at all of the instances where the County is reimbursed by other jurisdictions for services and how they are done before setting up funds. 5. Proposed Memorandum of Understanding -Haw River Trail Corridor Dave Stancil said that this is another MOU for the Haw River Trail Corridor. This is related to the Mountains to Sea Trail. There is a proposal to link the planned new Haw River State Park north of Greensboro, along the Haw River to Jordan Lake State Park. A proposed MOU has been crafted. Orange County has a small segment of Haw River in the southwestern corner of the County. At this paint it is conceptual and the MOU would have parties work together with the State to develop a plan and solicit thoughts from organizations. The idea is to have parts of a hiking trail on the Haw River and this is written so that Orange County will not have to build any part of the trail. If the trail is built, there will be maintenance obligations. He said that they thought it to be good to be at the table as the discussions proceed. The recommendation is to approve the MOU and authorize the staff of ERCD and Recreation and Parks to participate in the discussions. Commissioner Gordon asked how this related to the Mountains to Sea Trail and Dave Stancil said that the State has agreed to the corridor along the Haw River and cross-country to the Eno River as the preferred corridor. This would be an adjunct ar spur that might link back through Jordan Lake to the Mountains to Sea Trail. He has been assured that this would not be a competitive route. The Board agreed to add this item to the consent agenda on March 21St Additional Discussion of Item #2 Chair Jacobs said that when he and Dave Stancil went before the Carrbora Board of Aldermen, there was no discussion of separating out the school site from the park. He was not trying to mislead the Board. It never came up at the meeting. Commissioner Halkiotis asked about possible monies to pay for the road structure and whether there would also be money for water and sewer extensions and Dave Stancil said that they talked briefly about it and they shared the change in the OWASA policy related to water and sewer extensions that would include a reimbursement mechanism. Commissioner Halkiotis wants this additional information with estimated costs because $23 million is significant for an elementary school. With no further items to discuss, the meeting was adjourned at 9:33 p.m. Barry Jacobs, Chair Donna S. Baker Clerk to the Board